Thirsty

davidj · 09-04-2011, 08:32 PM

Hi there ! I am a Physical Therapist in Colorado and have been practicing since 1986. Several years ago I went to Barrett Dorko's "Manually Managing Pain: The Use of Simple Contact for Neural Tension and Chronic Pain" course. Since that time, I have read a number of his book recommendations and attended an "Explain Pain" course. In some ways, I feel that I am starting my career over again. I was trained as a "structuralist" and am now very aware of the shortcomings of this perspective. In some ways, it has been a struggle for me to let go of old habits and presumptions. (The book, "Mistakes Were Made,But Not By Me" ,by Tavris and Aronson, is a nice summary of the subtle powers of confirmation bias, self justification, pyramid of choice, power of irrevocability, etc.) In any case, I am grateful to Mr. Dorko for starting me on this journey !

**Diane** · 09-04-2011, 09:04 PM

Hi davidj,
Welcome to Somasimple.

**Barrett Dorko** · 09-04-2011, 10:34 PM

David,

Thanks for remembering the course. I wish I could tell you I remember but I was in Colorado several times over the years.

Changing requires that we have both the courage to allow something to die and the courage to say "I don't know."

Sounds like you've got it.

Welcome.

**zimney3pt** · 10-04-2011, 12:30 AM

Welcome David, yes letting go of the safety of the shore of structuralism is scarry as it opens up into an amazing ocean of neuroscience. But it is a wonderful journey

davidj · 16-04-2011, 12:12 PM

Thanks for the encouraging words. ( I'm learning this site is like quicksand-once you get in, it's tough to get out.)

norton · 16-04-2011, 04:25 PM

Just be careful what and how you ask questions about.
Deb

**Bas Asselbergs** · 16-04-2011, 04:35 PM

Welcome David!
Ask ANY question you like: as long as you can handle the answers, you'll be fine.

davidj · 16-04-2011, 05:03 PM

Got it ! Thanks.

norton · 16-04-2011, 05:26 PM

David,
As long as the answers are understandable and consistent one has no difficulty. When lines get blurry here on this scientific sight and one questions a concept be prepared to get belittled, especially if one is just a PTA. At least in my personal experience.
Deb

**Barrett Dorko** · 16-04-2011, 05:31 PM

Amazing.

Deb identifies herself as a PTA, I refer to her as one and she then says that this "belittles" her.

Is she something else?

norton · 16-04-2011, 06:09 PM

Here is a good thread where I felt uncomfortable.

http://www.somasimple.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9539

There is quite a bit of good info in it and it has lead me to writing my notes in quite a different manner. Just the brevity of some responses was frustrating.
Referring to me as a PTA is expected not belittling since I iz one.
Deb

**Jason Silvernail** · 16-04-2011, 06:38 PM

Welcome David. You might like the "Crossing the Chasm: Meso to Ecto" thread. Find it with the search option. Welcome again.

**John W** · 16-04-2011, 08:25 PM

Quote:

( I'm learning this site is like quicksand-once you get in, it's tough to get out.)

Fortunately, there are others here who are more than willing to help you so that you don't drown yourself.

I have been nowhere else online in the PT community where members provide such charitable access to their knowledge and experience. Which is not to suggest that this is some kind of love fest, tea party atmosphere, on the contrary, the debate here is vigorous and Occam's razor is wielded often mercilessly at untenable ideas or poorly developed and reasoned arguments.

That's what keeps it interesting and the faint of heart/feeble of mind away- at least most of them.

Welcome, David.

**nari** · 16-04-2011, 10:10 PM

Welcome, David.

Quote:

( I'm learning this site is like quicksand-once you get in, it's tough to get out.)

Possibly, but only if you struggle against the grains; relax and soak it up. Enjoy.

Nari

davidj · 16-04-2011, 10:44 PM

Jason, I read that thread a while back (via bodyinmind.org ?). That's one of the reasons I'm here. Barrett, my son has Aspergers. I was deeply touched by your essay "With Death Comes Food".

As I get older, I have more questions and less answers. I suppose I'm used to life "shaving away" former presuppositions...and, though at times painful, I know this is a good thing. I take Nari's suggestion to heart ! Thanks again for the warm welcome.

**Jason Silvernail** · 16-04-2011, 11:41 PM

Hi David. BIM linked to "Enough is Enough", and Crossing the Chasm is a different one. And you are thinking about Barrett's essay on Aspergers.
We've got a lot of material here so it's easy to get it jumbled. Welcome again.

09-04-2011, 08:32 PM	#1
davidj Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Age: 58 Posts: 16 Thanks: 19 Thanked 7 Times in 2 Posts	Thirsty Hi there ! I am a Physical Therapist in Colorado and have been practicing since 1986. Several years ago I went to Barrett Dorko's "Manually Managing Pain: The Use of Simple Contact for Neural Tension and Chronic Pain" course. Since that time, I have read a number of his book recommendations and attended an "Explain Pain" course. In some ways, I feel that I am starting my career over again. I was trained as a "structuralist" and am now very aware of the shortcomings of this perspective. In some ways, it has been a struggle for me to let go of old habits and presumptions. (The book, "Mistakes Were Made,But Not By Me" ,by Tavris and Aronson, is a nice summary of the subtle powers of confirmation bias, self justification, pyramid of choice, power of irrevocability, etc.) In any case, I am grateful to Mr. Dorko for starting me on this journey !

09-04-2011, 09:04 PM	#2
Diane Human Primate Social Groomer and Neuroelastician Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Weyburn Sask. Posts: 19,814 Thanks: 1,544 Thanked 3,367 Times in 1,630 Posts	Hi davidj, Welcome to Somasimple. __________________ Diane www.dermoneuromodulation.com SensibleSolutionsPhysiotherapy HumanAntiGravitySuit blog Neurotonics PT Teamblog Diane Jacobs.com (personal website) Canadian Physiotherapy Pain Science Division (Archived newsletters) Canadian Physiotherapy Association Pain Science Division Facebook page @PainPhysiosCan WCPT PhysiotherapyPainNetwork on Facebook @WCPTPTPN Neuroscience and Pain Science for Manual PTs Facebook page @dfjpt SomaSimple on Facebook @somasimple "Rene Descartes was very very smart, but as it turned out, he was wrong." ~Lorimer Moseley “Comment is free, but the facts are sacred.” ~Charles Prestwich Scott, nephew of founder and editor (1872-1929) of The Guardian , in a 1921 Centenary editorial “If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you, but if you really make them think, they'll hate you." ~Don Marquis "In times of change, learners inherit the earth, while the learned find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists" ~Roland Barth "Doubt is not a pleasant mental state, but certainty is a ridiculous one."~Voltaire

09-04-2011, 10:34 PM	#3
Barrett Dorko Writer and Clinician Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio Age: 61 Posts: 12,901 Thanks: 663 Thanked 1,542 Times in 908 Posts	David, Thanks for remembering the course. I wish I could tell you I remember but I was in Colorado several times over the years. Changing requires that we have both the courage to allow something to die and the courage to say "I don't know." Sounds like you've got it. Welcome. __________________ Barrett L. Dorko P.T. www.barrettdorko.com

10-04-2011, 12:30 AM	#4
zimney3pt life long learner, clinician, and instructor Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Sioux City, IA Age: 43 Posts: 1,906 Thanks: 152 Thanked 687 Times in 267 Posts	Welcome David, yes letting go of the safety of the shore of structuralism is scarry as it opens up into an amazing ocean of neuroscience. But it is a wonderful journey __________________ Kory Zimney, PT, DPT http://koryzimney.blogspot.com "Study principles not methods, a mind that can grasp principles will create its own methods." - Gill "All truths are easy to understand once they are discovered; the point is to discover them." - Galileo Galilei

16-04-2011, 04:35 PM	#7
Bas Asselbergs Physiotherapist Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Canada Age: 61 Posts: 3,724 Thanks: 875 Thanked 500 Times in 244 Posts	Welcome David! Ask ANY question you like: as long as you can handle the answers, you'll be fine. __________________ We don't see things as they are, we see things as WE are - Anais Nin Education by itself is no paranormal prophylactic - Michael Shermer Pain is a conscious correlate of the implicit perception of threat to body tissue - Lorimer Moseley

16-04-2011, 12:12 PM	#5
davidj Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Age: 58 Posts: 16 Thanks: 19 Thanked 7 Times in 2 Posts	Thanks for the encouraging words. ( I'm learning this site is like quicksand-once you get in, it's tough to get out.)

16-04-2011, 04:25 PM	#6
norton Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Age: 43 Posts: 368 Thanks: 24 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Just be careful what and how you ask questions about. Deb

16-04-2011, 05:03 PM	#8
davidj Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Age: 58 Posts: 16 Thanks: 19 Thanked 7 Times in 2 Posts	Got it ! Thanks.

16-04-2011, 05:26 PM	#9
norton Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Age: 43 Posts: 368 Thanks: 24 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	David, As long as the answers are understandable and consistent one has no difficulty. When lines get blurry here on this scientific sight and one questions a concept be prepared to get belittled, especially if one is just a PTA. At least in my personal experience. Deb

16-04-2011, 05:31 PM	#10
Barrett Dorko Writer and Clinician Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio Age: 61 Posts: 12,901 Thanks: 663 Thanked 1,542 Times in 908 Posts	Amazing. Deb identifies herself as a PTA, I refer to her as one and she then says that this "belittles" her. Is she something else? __________________ Barrett L. Dorko P.T. www.barrettdorko.com

16-04-2011, 06:09 PM	#11
norton Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Age: 43 Posts: 368 Thanks: 24 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Here is a good thread where I felt uncomfortable. http://www.somasimple.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9539 There is quite a bit of good info in it and it has lead me to writing my notes in quite a different manner. Just the brevity of some responses was frustrating. Referring to me as a PTA is expected not belittling since I iz one. Deb

16-04-2011, 06:38 PM	#12
Jason Silvernail Clinician and Researcher Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Kandahar Province, Afghanistan Age: 39 Posts: 4,085 Thanks: 127 Thanked 550 Times in 186 Posts	Welcome David. You might like the "Crossing the Chasm: Meso to Ecto" thread. Find it with the search option. Welcome again. __________________ Jason Silvernail DPT, DSc, FAAOMPT Board-Certified in Orthopedic Physical Therapy Fellowship-Trained in Orthopedic Manual Therapy Certified Strength and Conditioning Specialist The views expressed in this entry are those of the author alone and do not reflect the official policy or position of the Department of the Army, Department of Defense, or the US Government.

16-04-2011, 10:44 PM	#15
davidj Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Age: 58 Posts: 16 Thanks: 19 Thanked 7 Times in 2 Posts	Jason, I read that thread a while back (via bodyinmind.org ?). That's one of the reasons I'm here. Barrett, my son has Aspergers. I was deeply touched by your essay "With Death Comes Food". As I get older, I have more questions and less answers. I suppose I'm used to life "shaving away" former presuppositions...and, though at times painful, I know this is a good thing. I take Nari's suggestion to heart ! Thanks again for the warm welcome.

16-04-2011, 11:41 PM	#16
Jason Silvernail Clinician and Researcher Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Kandahar Province, Afghanistan Age: 39 Posts: 4,085 Thanks: 127 Thanked 550 Times in 186 Posts	Hi David. BIM linked to "Enough is Enough", and Crossing the Chasm is a different one. And you are thinking about Barrett's essay on Aspergers. We've got a lot of material here so it's easy to get it jumbled. Welcome again. __________________ Jason Silvernail DPT, DSc, FAAOMPT Board-Certified in Orthopedic Physical Therapy Fellowship-Trained in Orthopedic Manual Therapy Certified Strength and Conditioning Specialist The views expressed in this entry are those of the author alone and do not reflect the official policy or position of the Department of the Army, Department of Defense, or the US Government.

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