VIS Smashing Your Guts

[byronselorme]

I really really don't know where to begin with this.

Sorry but I had to put this somewhere.

Jill Miller Smashes Your Guts! (and psoas, and tacked down viscera, and matted down abdominals…) Part 2

[Diane]

This does nothing to help me live more comfortably with my own interoception. What a bunch of macho crap.

[Milehigh]

Cross fit 'meats' physical therapy. I looked at his ACL progression. Could not make sense of it and I found a lot wrong with what I could figure out.

[nari]

Tacked??? Matted??? Is this person working on a fishing trawler?



Nari

[keithp]

Originally Posted by Milehigh

Cross fit 'meats' physical therapy. I looked at his ACL progression. Could not make sense of it and I found a lot wrong with what I could figure out.

I wasted 20 minutes surfing...and shaking my head. Over the last year, I have decided to make a conscious effort to spend half the time speaking to my patient that they spend speaking to me. My father has always said I sound smarter the less I talk...besides, the more opportunities I have to listen to my patient, the greater the chance of their being heard. In contrast, I doubt his patients get to speak at all...this self-aggrandizing machismo is something I cannot relate to.

And by the way, is this the same therapist who was wrapping an elbow with a bicycle tube? If so, it seems that he has devised a marketable version of his own.

Regardless, I hope I am not the only one who sees a problem when this therapist is getting 25,000+ views on some of his vids, providing athletic training to 5 year olds, selling 7' rubber bands for $24 a pair and is on his way to fitness fame while one of our bros* east of the Mississippi only averages 1-2k per posting and is soon returning to migrant work.

Some nights I wonder...

Respectfully,
Keith

* (Kelly says this A LOT in other vids, none of which I recommend)

[Diane]

the more opportunities I have to listen to my patient, the greater the chance of their being heard.

All that, plus:
1. You will have the opportunities to develop insight/pick up more clues about them
2. They have a greater opportunity to develop insight/pick up their own clues, by listening to themselves talk, and learning how to listen to themselves.

I think we underestimate the importance of the patient learning how to tell a coherent story, and be listened to by that part of their own brain which can help - their own critter brain.

[byronselorme]

Keith I think you are right on!

Jill Miller has been featured on the cover of the Yoga Therapists journal. Watching this Is enough to want to pass a law.

[keithp]

Originally Posted by byronselorme

Keith I think you are right on!

I think it was ANdy at one point in the last month (or so) who mentioned that a colleague who does not practice with the same insight and feeds his patients inaccurate information still may be a "better" therapist than he is.

When I watch Kelly speak I get the same feeling: I would wager that he would get FAR better results with his patients (considering their expectations) than I would in the same setting (granted, an 80-yr old female at home with CHF and chronic pain would certainly be another story).

Smart guy with a profitable plan, though: Get involved with and market an exercise fad with an attitude that surrounds a particular core belief system, then build a model of treatment around those core beliefs already instilled in your soon-to-be-patients. When the patients necessarily arrive, they are already indoctrinated in the model and "know" they will get better. Speak with charisma and certainty, do so often and in a relate-able manner, bro. He is a creating a culture that is self-referring and extremely susceptible to suggestion/placebo...not a bad plan, no?

Respectfully,
Keith

[ste5e]

Most of his patients will get better because most of them would have got better anyway. His pathological levels of self-belief will sustain him and many acolytes in thinking he has the answer. We will see the ones that it does not work for and we lead them quietly and compassionately in a different direction.
Not everyone needs to know how the magician does his tricks. And this guy has some great stagecraft. But when the patients need to understand how the magician works in order to move forwards then here we are waiting to explain.
He may get more people better than me but I do not think it is a numbers competition that he and his type are winning. There are 75 million in the states with persisting pain. Go big guy, rage on. I think I could do well stepping into his case load, could he do as well stepping into mine?
We are the future.
Kind thoughts,
Steve

[Barrett Dorko]

I think this guy will "win" in the end because the contest is already over and we're dead.

I watched the whole video and though he's obviously making up a lot of this as he goes along, the ignorance of his intended audience insures that they would never know that.

In my second week at my previous job a similarly built PT bragged about taking his two-year-old son to doctor's offices costumed as Cupid on Valentine's Day and handing each receptionist a rose as if he were The Bachelor and they his possible intended. I'm not kidding.

On a certain level this is funny. On another, insulting. On yet another, inevitable.

This site is a refuge from such things, but it's only that - we still have to go out into the actual world.

[Ken Jakalski]

Hi Barrett!

I watched the whole video and though he's obviously making up a lot of this as he goes along, the ignorance of his intended audience insures that they would never know that.

You are so right about Mel being ahead of his time.

He noted this:

"The disquieting aspect of this type of speculation is that it is being spread to hordes of personal trainers, the general public and new PT graduates without being subjected to an understanding of basic logic and the scientific method. It is apparent that the latter subjects are being sadly neglected both at university and popular level. Far too often, it is apparent that content is being taught without an understanding of research, the scientific method, accuracy, statistical analysis and the fundamental process of
analytical thinking."

[Ken Jakalski]

a similarly built PT

Yes. Guys like that don't worry about their t-shirts moving against them rather than with them.

[advantage1]

The first video appears to be filmed in a shed and the second in his garage. The second video is hilarious as you watch him use big words and write them on his kids chalk board. At one point he asks them to be queit since Daddy is working!

I always thought the magician also required a nice stage for their magic to work. Apparaently not.

Social media is a great thing and also dangerous. Now anybody can call themselves an expert and broadcast their message to the world. I would argue that the internet has created more chronic pain.

[docjohn]

This fella made me throw up in my mouth for the first time since the Pat's lost to the Giants (again) in Feb. Seared Ahi is so much better the first time.
Simply a case of the "smart kid in the dumb row" at school. Spewing undefinable trainer lingo and developing a following. I have seen this many times...it isn't going away. We keep our own houses in order.
As far as releasing the psoas, is it aware it is being released and where would it go anyway?
Is there a home for little released psoas's...aimlessly wandering the earth after being haphazardly released by some three letter technique? My gosh, what would they eat? Where would they sleep? After all it is a very emotional muscle.

[amacs]

Originally Posted by keithp

I think it was ANdy at one point in the last month (or so) who mentioned that a colleague who does not practice with the same insight and feeds his patients inaccurate information still may be a "better" therapist than he is.

When I watch Kelly speak I get the same feeling: I would wager that he would get FAR better results with his patients (considering their expectations) than I would in the same setting (granted, an 80-yr old female at home with CHF and chronic pain would certainly be another story).

Smart guy with a profitable plan, though: Get involved with and market an exercise fad with an attitude that surrounds a particular core belief system, then build a model of treatment around those core beliefs already instilled in your soon-to-be-patients. When the patients necessarily arrive, they are already indoctrinated in the model and "know" they will get better. Speak with charisma and certainty, do so often and in a relate-able manner, bro. He is a creating a culture that is self-referring and extremely susceptible to suggestion/placebo...not a bad plan, no?

Respectfully,
Keith

I hear that, it does nothing for my opinion of the profession and even less for my sense of identity within it. I am confused and remain so, perhaps more accurately I feel a lot of dissonance.

How do I resolve it ... hmmmm.

Fight or flight baby, fight or flight.

regards

ANdy

p.s. who is the guy in the vid

[amacs]

Originally Posted by Ken Jakalski

Hi Barrett!



You are so right about Mel being ahead of his time.

He noted this:

"The disquieting aspect of this type of speculation is that it is being spread to hordes of personal trainers, the general public and new PT graduates without being subjected to an understanding of basic logic and the scientific method. It is apparent that the latter subjects are being sadly neglected both at university and popular level. Far too often, it is apparent that content is being taught without an understanding of research, the scientific method, accuracy, statistical analysis and the fundamental process of
analytical thinking."

Ken

what bothers me is that the thinking Mel refers to is prevalent even into the higher levels of education including Masters. I hope that the highest levels knock it out (or in) of the doctoral level but recently I am not so sure as I see PhD's being run in subject areas that relate directly to a therapists practice and I fear for the neutrality of the principal. Too few of these people are analytical by nature and even less wish to become so, while that is not always a desirable characteristic it certainly helps!



regards

ANdy

[zendogg]

At the risk of starting something here....

I agree with most of the comments here regarding how dude is presenting the info in the first video. I did not bother to watch the second. But I offer you this. I have found that by either using my hand or by teaching my clients to use tools such as the ball demonstrated in the video that they can learn to elicit ideomotion once I've taught them what to look for.
I imagine dude has never heard the word ideomotion and because of so much jumbled mesodermal dreamery he places all the credit on the ball.
I have found, however, that if you can ask a client to use such an implement very slowly and learn to feel the FIRST sense of barrier (obviously that means you are not driving or digging the ball into your guts) and then wait there, really feel and experience the quality and texture and direction of resistance, that ideomotion will begin and modify the resistance.
I love that they attribute the feeling of change to a release of the psoas! How the hell do they know what changed?
But, I am leaning on a suspicion that the actual change that IS being experienced by users of the gut crush is one that comes from ideomotion. The ball is a way to direct the intelligence of the sensory system to recognize a motor mistake and to have the opportunity to reorganize it. Try it on your self and see if you can get the motion to come. YOU MUST DO IT WITH GENTLENESS AND SENSITIVITY AND PATIENCE. If you are able to elicit ideomotion, you will now have a chance to provide the same AWESOME! results as dude and provide an explanation that is infinitely more aligned with science and self-reliance. Sounds like a pretty good business model to me.

Nathan

[Barrett Dorko]

Ideomotion doesn't "begin" with provocation - it's already there. Context catalyzes it and, usually, makes it visible.

[zendogg]

I am having trouble deciphering the difference between "already there" and "visible". Would amplify be correct?

In other words, until I hold someone's head they don't appear to be swaying around like Stevie Wonder. Only after I begin holding them.

[zendogg]

I also see the provocation you mention as a way for the sensory system to become aware of an area that it has either not had the need to change or has not been adequately in touch with to bother to change it. Thoughts?

[Barrett Dorko]

I think that the verbal analogy is more useful here.

We are constantly forming speech which we may or may not express, depending upon the circumstances. Think of someone saying something recently (very recently) planned and another saying, "I've been wanting to say this for a long time."

Where were the words prior to their expression? How helpful did they end up being? Isn't speaking just another form of expressing? This is a complex thing, as is our movement - especially in a culture that restricts movement expression that is non-verbal.

As far as I know, you can't amplify something whose expression you cannot predict. I can create a context that permits it though, and, in that, my manner and touch will be regarded as novel; something the human animal attends to.

"Already there" simply refers to the fact that ideomotion is inherent to life, kind of like our ability to speak but not exactly, of course. You keep writing as if ideomotion is that which is seen, but neither is the beating of our heart. It's palpable though.

You want it to do more? Catalyze it with your manner, touch and words - but please stop saying that it begins when you see it.

[keithp]

Don't ask what made me come across this, but it made me smile: BroTips.com

Respectfully,
Keith